2016-10-06 08:53:32 +0200 <mgsloan> Heck, lets face it, the community as it exists now, and all the industrial adoption, would not have been possible without cabal
2016-10-06 08:53:12 +0200 <mgsloan> piyush-kurur: Indeed I agree! Stack would not have been possible without cabal
2016-10-06 08:52:40 +0200 <piyush-kurur> mgsloan: I think the existence of stack and cabal is actually a healthy thing
2016-10-06 08:52:35 +0200 <hvr> otoh, cabal's issue tracker gained ~150 new tickets in a short time specifically about nix-local-build
2016-10-06 08:51:48 +0200 <mgsloan> True, stack has a bigger scope than cabal-install, and people appreciate that
2016-10-06 08:51:23 +0200 <hvr> could also mean that ppl have more expectations in stack than cabal, and bother to file issues ;-))
2016-10-06 08:50:07 +0200 <mgsloan> One indication of popularity may be issue tracker activity. Stack has a total of 2089 issues, cabal has a total of 2678. So about 80% the number of issues, in about 1.5 years of existing
2016-10-06 08:47:48 +0200 <hvr> so I have to assume that there's still a significant amount of cabal users out there
2016-10-06 08:47:27 +0200 <hvr> mgsloan: hard to tell... I still see lots of cabal-install traffic in hackage's logs (and not from the travis cluster)
2016-10-06 08:46:17 +0200 <piyush-kurur> hvr: I did not mean that cabal cannot be used as a deployer. I just meant it is easiest to use stack (some one else has done the curating for me)
2016-10-06 08:46:06 +0200 <cocreature> annoyingly cabal new-build also doesn’t support building & uploading docs so I have to use regular sandboxes
2016-10-06 08:45:52 +0200 <hvr> and there's little traffic on the hackage-trustees issue tracker, so ppl can't have that many cabal hell issues
2016-10-06 08:45:15 +0200 <hvr> otoh, pure cabal solving works out just as well; I almost never run into cabal hell myself
2016-10-06 08:45:09 +0200 <cocreature> mgsloan: sort of but when I want solving I usually find cabal easier to use. also uploading docs is a usecase that is simply not possible with stack at all so I _have_ to use cabal for this
2016-10-06 08:44:24 +0200 <piyush-kurur> as a developer when doing travis builds for example I find cabal more useful for the reasons hvr said
2016-10-06 08:44:18 +0200 <mgsloan> Uses cabal-install for dep solving :D
2016-10-06 08:43:47 +0200 <cocreature> I’m pretty happy that we have both stack & cabal. I regularly switch between them depending on which one is best for my particular usecase
2016-10-06 08:43:05 +0200 <piyush-kurur> i really mean it. stack and cabal are both useful. I find both of them useful.
2016-10-06 08:42:26 +0200 <piyush-kurur> oh god: I hope I did not start a holy war. I like both stack and cabal and no this is not a general policitically correct statement
2016-10-06 08:39:44 +0200 <hvr> mgsloan: the experiment isn't done yet; the situation is improving with cabal, you just don't seem to notice
2016-10-06 08:38:53 +0200 <mgsloan> Cabal hell came way before stack, it's been there from day 1
2016-10-06 08:38:12 +0200 <mgsloan> Cabal hell is certainly punishment
2016-10-06 08:37:04 +0200 <mgsloan> So basically, you're telling me we should put up with our tools causing problems for us all the time..? So that we feel that whip of cabal hell, and update our version ranges by hand?
2016-10-06 08:36:19 +0200 <hvr> mgsloan: if cabal were to not use solving by default, we'd run into the problem that people would care even less about version constraints
2016-10-06 08:35:42 +0200 <hvr> mgsloan: well, by extending cabal's UI to give more hints
2016-10-06 08:35:23 +0200 <mgsloan> "Read the docs" doesn't work so well for cabal
2016-10-06 08:35:03 +0200 <hvr> mgsloan: for that you have now 2 freezing levels with cabal; either full freeze or just index-state freeze (or both)
2016-10-06 08:33:44 +0200 <mgsloan> hvr: Sure, and we wrap Cabal's solver so that you can use it at the right times
2016-10-06 08:33:40 +0200 <srhb> mgsloan: While cabal-install works very well with nix :)
2016-10-06 08:33:30 +0200 <hvr> mgsloan: and by powerful I mean the more general flexible solver-centric design space cabal is exploring
2016-10-06 08:33:12 +0200 <mgsloan> With Cabal, there's no telling what is going on in someone's environment
2016-10-06 08:30:07 +0200 <hvr> yeah, and that's why there's cabal and stack :)
2016-10-06 08:22:19 +0200 <piyush-kurur> you can get some of stacks pinning by just putting in the appropriate constraints in a cabal.config file
2016-10-06 08:21:41 +0200 <piyush-kurur> stack is like debian releases (although more frequent) and cabal is like arch linux
2016-10-06 08:21:07 +0200 <piyush-kurur> jle: stack and cabal, as far as I see it has two purposes.